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35 Whelen

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LA dept of wildlife and fisheries will not allow the use of the 35 Whelen during the primitive weapons season. The law states 38cal or larger. 38cal. is .357 and the 35 Whelen is .358. I have spoken with both the Lake Charles and Baton Rouge inforcment divisions and niether seem to understand how 35cal can be larger than 38cal.I wonder how long it took them to understand that 12 gauge was larger than 20 gauge? In both instances thier response was' how can 35 be larger than 38'. I didn't write the law and I doubt the ones who did understand what they wrote. Look it up, its only 3 pages long! The sad thing is sportsmen across the state are being hadicaped by someone elses inability to understand. While I can legally hunt deer with a marginal weapon,357 magnum, I am prohibited from hunting with a much superior weapon.Don't take my word for it, look it up for yourself. Look up the law on the web or contact your local represenitive for a copy. Then check out the ballistic charts and compare them all, 45-70, 444, 44 magnum, 357 magnum, and 35 Whelen. If you don't already know you will be suprised. I think it's sad that sportsmen are prohibited because those who inforce the law don't understand the law they are inforcing!
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   hunt r
.357, .358, .380, 35cal. is not larger than .38cal., sorry. .444 and .45/70 were original blackpowder loads, the .35 Whelen was introduced in 1965 with smokeless powder so it is not a 'primitive' caliber or gun.
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Despite its name, the .38 Special caliber is actually .357–.358 inches (9.0678 mm), with the '.38' referring to the approximate diameter of the loaded brass case. This came about because the original .38-caliber cartridge, the .38 Short Colt, was designed for use in converted .36-caliber cap-and-ball (muzzleloading) Navy revolvers, which had cylindrical firing chambers of approximately 0.374-inch (9.5 mm) diameter, requiring heeled bullets, the exposed portion of which was the same diameter as the cartridge case.
Except for case length, the .38 Special is identical to that of the .38 Long Colt, and the .357 Magnum. This allows the .38 Special round to be safely fired in revolvers chambered for the .357 Magnum, and the .38 Long Colt to be fired in revolvers chambered for .38 Special, increasing the versatility of this cartridge. However, the longer and more powerful .357 Magnum cartridge will not chamber and fire in .38-caliber weapons, which are not designed for the greatly increased pressure of the magnum round.
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Hunt r the 444 is I believe a fairly new round designed for the Marlin 444 unlike its cousin the 45/70 which has a rich history being loaded as Black powder or the military first cartridge rifle the Springfield trapdoor or the Buffalo hunting rifles etc.
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The 444 Marlin was introduced in 1964. The law states nothing about when the caliber was developed its simply reads,' Single shot breech loading rifles that are .38 caliber or larger manufactured prior to 1900 and replicas, reproductions or reintroductions having an exposed hammer that uses metallic cartridges loaded either with black powder or modern smokeless powder are also classified as primitive firearms'.As long as the rifle design was was being manufactured prior to 1900 then the rifle is legal.
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   hunt r
Ya'll are right about the .444 and i have no idea why it is legal. The one, you are also right that the model of gun is important and i dont have a list of legal guns. However the .35 Whelen was never a blackpowder round nor did it have a gun loaded for it. Not sure why .35 ever gets in this discussion, is it now loaded in a 'legal gun'?
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   PaleRider
I think the point he is trying to make is that the .35 Whelen should be legal now. Like said earlier, the .38 caliber is actually a .357. The .35 Whelen is a .358. The round was developed in 1922 and was just a 30-06 necked up to fit a .357 bullet. The 350 Remington Magnum came out in 1965. The state of MS has changed their rules after realizing the same mistake from what I've heard. Maybe LA doesn't want to admit theirs! If they eventually make it legal, I'll save some of you guys some time and tell you now, the .444 and 45-70 don't come close!
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   sf49ers
I'd like to say i hunt this state with all legal means provided to us by the ldwf. but to say that we are at a disadvantge by the 35 whelen not being considered primitive is absurd. last year i killed a good buck at 165 yards with a .444 and i don't consider that to be primitive, that's better than a football field and a half. all of these weapons mentioned are still centerfire calibers and are far more than advanced considering the limitations of a muzzleloader. will i still hunt with my 'primitive .444' yes because it is legal, but if i had a vote i'd vote to go back to the old muzzleloader seasson, because a .444 or 35 whelen can both take deer out to 300 yards if you know anything about bullet drop. i take deer with rifles, 'primitive' weapons, muzzloaders and bows and hunt all because they are legal. let's be realistic, spinning a topic like the 35 whelen in a primitive arms season is ridiculous, we are not at a disadvantage without it, remember we had a real muzzloader season long before 'primitive seasons'
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I believe you are the only one that reconizes my point. You are also right about the 35 Whelen being superior to 444 and 45-70.
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I am a bit off topic but I just feel the need to express my thoughts.

I believe it is sad that rifle scopes and non-muzzleloaders are allowed during the muzzleloader season. In my opinion if you are going to allow someone to hunt with a 444 you might as well open it up to anything.
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   hunt r
Mike, as a long time hunter in miss. i dont see why people think blackpowder is inferior to modern. They think a 45/70 is a big gun. Heck, i shoot a .50/110. Buffalo hunters killed animals 5 times larger than deer at 500yds. As for accuracy, rebel troops shot balls thru peepholes in union lines at 800yds. As much as i love my double set trigger hawken, i do use an inline in the regular season, easier to clean. 380ACP, 38 s&w, 38 long colt are .35 caliber, not .38. The rule of .38 cal or more only applies to blackpowder, there eare no .38 cal modern rifles. All those are pistol rounds shooting a 110gr. bullet with 500ft.lbs. of muzzle energy. A .35whelen shoots a 22o gr. bullet with 3,000 ft. lbs. of energy at 200 yds.
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