Help...the law SUCKS!!!!

I have a problem need help. There is a guy hunting on the property next to ours, he has cut trees down on our land so he can see onto us. His stand is right on the property line but he is clearly hunting on us, he even has his rice bran on us and he has to climb over a fence to come onto us. Well on 10/21/11 I was making an afternoon hunt got on stand at about 4:15pm and then at about 5:00pm I watched the man climb in the tree. At 6:15 I had a 5 point buck walk out in the bean field, looked at him and decided not to shot, he was maybe a 2 year old and small so I started to film him with my video camera. Well he walked right in front of me about 30 yrds away and was walking straight towards the man in the tree, when the buck got about 75 yrds from me and directly in between me and the man in the tree, two button bucks came out of the woods into the bean field to meet the other buck. Well then it happened the man shot the buck and then shot one of the button buck right in front of me on our land. Then I sat and filmed two men walk out of the woods and retrieve the two deer. They clearly shot the deer on our property. I stoped them and told them the cops and dept of WLF were on the way. They dropped the deer and left the property before anyone arrived. Well the sheriff dept. arrived took our statement and went look for the Man (I do know who he is and I have it all on film). The wildlife agent called me and said it was to late to start the investigation 8:00pm and it would mess up his schedule and he would come meet me in the morning. Long story short they came, watched the video and told us we could keep the deer and they could only charge the men with a tagging violation for not tagging the deer. They did not care at all that he shot the deer on our property or cut down our tress, because he stated we do not own the deer the state of LA owns the deer. so it is perfectly fine to shoot any deer on anybody's property as long as you follow the hunting laws, the only thing is you can not go retrieve the deer without permission from the land owner. So the scum bag got off with a trespassing violation and a Tagging violation and to top it off the WLF agent took the deer from us that he told us we could keep so we cleaned them and iced them down only to be giving back to the low life who shot them!!! does anybody believe any other laws were broken and is there anything I can do since the Dept of WLF will not help Thanks

That really sucks! If you don't mind, what part of the state is this in?

Dont quit on this issue contact the Sheriff himself, let him knoqw u will not tolerate tresspassing. Contact WLF back complain how the agent wouldnt put effort into this. I cant stand a trespasser. Dont let it go until u get justice.

The scary thing is he did not even know you were there and he is firing off rounds in your direction. That kind of behavior should get someones liscense revoked. I feel this is Poaching. He is killing deer on your property with out permission. I truly hope the Wildlife Dept. will step up here.

This happened in jefferson davis parish just south of Jennings. This really has my blood boiling. I cant believe this is how it is getting treated I feared for my life the low life shot straight towards me. I am 39 and I as long as I have hunted I always thought it was illegal to shot game on other peoples property. Now with this slap on the hand, you think he going to stop? The WLF agent said that the man told him that he shot the deer on his land and that both deer ran onto us yea right.. and they just happened to fall 10 feet apart from each other. The game warden did not even go the property to check it out I could have showed him the exact spot of impact but the game warden did not care it was like I was a bother!!! YOU ARE FREE TO HUNT WHERE EVER YOU WANT!!!!! I am defiantly not going to just sit and wait around for the WLF. I guess some blood is going to have to be shed before they do anything. It's going to be me in trouble! I guess everything I learned about poaching goes out the window!!! if this is not Poaching What IS!!!!!!!!!!!

well we are getting a new sheriff soon. That should help alot. who was the WLF agent?

You should have let it slide for the time being, worked with the Sheriff's office and put up a good camera to get the guy on your lease so you could have a case. Now it sounds like somebody made the mistake of calling out the man who enforces the law on a public website. Not a good idea even though I understand your anger. At least you would have had the meat until you could get him on video breaking the law. The Warden is right in that; it's the State's deer not the lease holders, even though the guy did wrong there was no proof he cut the trees, he did shoot from his lease and he didn't shoot at you as you both were in trees. I found long ago to try and get along with the neighbors. Somebody may cut down his tree stand when he's not around and now the finger is pointed at you!! Ray

Dont let this slide!! It sounds like the law is his buddys!You have video evidence already!I would call your local news crew,theyd be happy to come do a report on the evening news about laws not being enforced!This has my blood boiling and I dont even know you or live near you!I cant stand law enforcment that doesnt do thier job.Just b/c they have a badge doesnt mean they are special!!Please dont leave this alone,make some calls to Baton Rouge and speak with someone in charge about the LDWF agent and then call the local sheriffs dept and speak with the highest person you can!! Keep us posted

slab, the fact is that LDWF does not enforce tresspassing laws because they change from parish to parish and are fairly complex here in Louisiana. HOWEVER, they will enforce trespassing on DMAP property, which is a separate state law.

So if you can, enroll in DMAP - it's cheap, provides some real management benefits, and you still get to decide what to do on the property.

You might want to take the video to the local justice of the peace and ask about filing charges. That might get things moving.

I'd also call LDWF's Enforcement Division (225.765.2800) and talk with Col. Winton Vidrine or Jeff Mayne about the agents' response.

As to the neighboring landowner cutting timber on your land, that seems pretty clear - you should pursue that in court, if you can afford it.

Trespassing falls under a state staue, so if WLF want enforce it cause they choose not to. they enforece everything else drugs,DWI.

Tresspass falls under Title 14. It is State Law not Parish Law . You do not need posted signs . Everywhere in Louisiana is posted unless you have permission from the landowner or lease holder. That said the Sheriff may not wish to pursue the violation and the Da may or may not. I would talk directly to the Sheriff and DA not a Deputy or Asst DA. I would aslo call Winton Vidrine who is head of enforcement for Wildlife and Fisheries .If that fails give it to the news media along with copies of videos and what ever other documentation you may have. Also a letter to the editor of the local newspaper may help get action.

...it's true that the State does own the game...but they sure get tongue twisted and quite when you talk about navigating chains,gates and waterbottoms ???...but they do stay in true style at putt'n a 'Constipated Monkey' on the other guy...cheers

why did you tell the guys that the cops and LDWF were on the way?!? Shouldve let the cops come fist!

In Louisiana no matter who property you step foot on besides your own with out permission is trespassing.If the subject is in possession of a weapon or if it is to destroy or obliterate anothers property,its considered criminal trespassing,which is a felony.Now unless you have proof that the subject cut the trees on your property you could pursue charges and sue for damages.Now the fact that you have the subjects on your property on tape, while in possession of a firearm, retreiving the animal you could pursue charges because that is criminal trespasing but you cannot purue damages for the harvested animal because it is state property.You need to take this issue to local and state law enforcement along with your local district attorney.

We have a similar situation on our property. We hunt just under 200 acres of pine and hardwoods and to the east and right of us are cow fields. We put a lot of time and money into the land, but one of our neighbors gets to reap the rewards. Last season I watched three does eat and play on the tree line. Just before dark they jumped across the fence to go graze in the open cow field and not a minute later I had a shot that went off so close to me it almost made me need new underwear. I knew the stand was 30 yards behind me, but I had no idea he was actually in it. That’s not the main issue though. We watch a lot of deer walk so we can have good deer management on the property just like most of the other neighbors do, but this guy decides to have the theory of “if its brown, its down.” A couple of deer a year we could work with, but when he does this all the time it pisses us off. The bad part is that there is nothing we can do because he does it all on his property. All we can do is sit back and watch.

Well this matter really sucks because this is happening on our land that is private. The neighbor has two stands on the property line, he has clearly cut our trees down at both stands, his bran is clearly on our side and I keep getting the run around that there is nothing WLF can do about this. I did receive a call from the Regional Manager due to this post and was told that they will look further into this matter and they are on there way to pick up the video, but was still told that it is not illegal to shot deer on someone else property. I think this is Bull there has to be something wrong with this. I will not stop at this until something is done about this. I will take this matter as high as I have too. If this is the case then I think its time for a change, there needs to be something wrong with shooting a High power rifle onto your neighbor property even if the deer is owned by the state, just because the deer is owned by the state does not give you the right to shot the deer if its not on your property!!!! I do believe that they will be charged with trespassing and a tagging violation. Will keep you posted on the outcome.

Well under LA law wild game belongs to its captor thus even though he shot them on your land if he retrieves them, then they are his own. However he has to trespass to get them, not to mention the other instances of trespass when he cut the trees. That brings me to your real remedy, TRESPASS, you could prosecute him for trespassing on your land and probably destruction of property for the cutting of the trees. Get as much evidence as you can and at the least scare him enough to stay away. Find out when he is there and have the police on the way before he can leave, don't let him know of their presence, and let them catch him in the act. It might even just take an attorney writing him a letter, which would not cost much. I'd rather have cops bust him for criminal trespassing to teach him a lesson. I agree with others that if you keep on calling the local law enforcement they should at the least eventually do something. What have you got to lose because obviously they other guy won't stop and does not care about your SAFTEY. Good Luck

This is really a sad story and reminds me of why I gave up hunting. Life is too short to spend being so upset over nothing. Ya'll sound like 10 year olds!!

Well I think that everyone is missing the major point here i live in louisiana and the last time i looked at the pamplet under la law you can only harvest one antlered and one antlerless deer per day now what the ldwf is saying is that its ok to harvest two antlered deer in the same day at the same time as long as you tag them well sorry but in my opinion this guy should be prosecuted as a pocher cause thats exactly what he is and what he has done they should take his gun and his liscenes just like they would if you did this on d map or wma property its not ok to harvest deer like this on government land therefore its not legal to do it on private land especially on land that doesent belong to you

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Guys whatch what you type. I can see this being deleted. Would hate to see it go.

You two guys have been on this site about a year and one with no posts to his credit and when someone suggests ya'll cool it ya'll resort to name calling. I didn't quit hunting because of the issues, I quit hunting because you're generation became the so-called rulers of the woods and began telling folks when, where and how to hunt and what to kill. I quit before I shot one of those worms. One guy posted that the landowner next door was killing the deer they groomed and that was wrong even though they were on his property. If you notice, the guy that started the post complained about the guy on the fence-line but he was close enough to the line to record it on his phone. If I killed a deer and it ran on your property I would go get it and so would anyone else. This bull happens with-in clubs lots with other members hunted someone stand etc. I'm a 60yr old Vietnam Vet and when we met someone in the woods there was none of this crap and we all got along. Today many of you young guys spend thousands of dollars on a lease and food plots, etc. and are mad because you always want that 10 point and wind up with a doe. I have been on this site for a long time and have always fought for sportsman's rights so I don't think I will let a child run me off just like I fish where and when I want. RAY

Ray, you and I have disagreed on a few things over the last 10 years or so. But these crybabies, HOLEE CRAP!!! If he says the other guy is set up on HIS property line, then that means that HE IS SET UP ON THE OTHER GUY'S PROPERTY LINE. Jesus Christ man, learn how to hunt a deer other than shooting him off a bait pile

OK everyone lets not let this get out of hand. I edited a couple of comments for minor profanity and pulled one post for encouraging illegal behavior and then an over the top profanity post! Keep it clean.

One thing is true and that it isn't illegal to shoot a deer on your neighbors property. Retrieving it is another story.

You have video evidence and I would be looking into getting more if I were you. Repeat offenders get harsher punishments than one time out of the blue offenses.

Instead of shooting basically grazing cattle over a pasture, go out in the woods and kill you a deer, you crybaby.

cajunhopper,you must not have read the mans post.the neighbor shot a deer ON HIS PROPERTY. He simply mentioned that the stand was on the property line,not that it was illegal.Hes upset bc the guy keeps trespassing and he has every right to be upset over that.We all understand that you cant do anything about what your neighbor shoots as long as it is on his property.

I dont think the fella is crying about the guy hunting on the property line as much as he is complaining about the guy cutting his trees down, putting his rice bran on his property and retrieving a deer off of his property without permission!!

Slab is with in his rights to hunt the property line on HIS property just as the other guy is also, but the rest is WRONG!!! Ray I agree with you on the shooting the deer and retrieving it off of the other persons property but you do have to ask for permission to retrieve it. Wether you like it or not it is the law and also quite courteous to do so!!

What I see here is a tit for tat, these guys are set up on their property line for the same deer. Must be a hot spot. Maybe the area is a deer hotspot. I would bet the poster of the original post would shoot across the property line to kill a good buck. If he's willing to wage an online assault, he would also be willing to shoot over the property line. In this battle, he lost. I think he's more pissed about someone shooting a buck he passed on to grow than about the whole property line thing.

I bet if he saw a 180 class buck 100 feet on the other guy's land, he would shoot it.

My .02

cajunhopperv2/Ray

well cajunhopperv2 your comment isn't even worth .02 As to your comment about hunting grazing cattle and calling me names... wow, you can't even read the post for what it is, guess you don't know how to read and comprehend what you read. For your information I have 1500 acres of private land all hard woods, river bottoms and some pastures we hunt all of the areas and they are all free roaming and I kill all the deer I need...

Again to your other post, please keep your .02 to yourself I don't need change. If you can not comprehend why I posted my comment please don't respond. It was not to wage an online assault at all, point missed. The stand that I happened to be hunting that day is about 300yrs from the property line, his is 2 feet from the property line. I have made 5 hunts this year and I have seen 15 deer so far and I have not fired a shot yet, it's not about the deer, point miss again!!! This was not filmed with my phone but with a professional video camera, which is what I make my living with. Maybe you would shot a 180 class buck 100 feet on the other guy's land, but I want, so before you make a statement like that about me, please get to know me. I have not lost this battle, this battle is just getting started we gave the guy a fare warning the weekend before and he still chose to do this. Don't mess with me and I want mess with you, but piss me off and it's on!!! You are responsible for your on actions!!

Ray, sorry but wow, did you read my post at all? what's up with this quote 'the guy that started the post complained about the guy on the fence-line but he was close enough to the line to record it on his phone' wow!!! that's no where in this report. That's the problem with some people they open there mouth before they even know what they are talking about!!! I hope you didn't read my post before you responded, because you sure missed the point!!!

Geronimo sez:...put on 'ya spike helmets, Gen.Goldfinger called out 'da militia...Hannibal coming w/'da rumble'n elephants...it's like dropp'n 'skip bombs' on 'dem Gustoppo Jerrys !!!???...cheers

This is my .02. Who actually declared the location of the property line in dispute. Unless a survey crew/engineer etc., actually rendered an opinion, then who really knows where the property line is located. Because you always thought a line was located at a certain place does not make it located there. The section, township and range divisions of land in Louisiana are clear, but can be confusing. Actual property lines often are mislocated by upwards of 100'. One can search any courthouse in Louisiana and see the many, many number of boundry line dispute cases which exist becasue people 'think' they know where the boundry line is located.

So my .02 is before criminal accuations are made, one should be certain where his property begins and ends.

This is truly amazing!!!!!

huh!!! is right, let's see maybe the barb wire fence that was installed years ago according to a surveyor is a good indication of the property line, in which he has to climb over. It amazes me to read some of these reports, and how people can respond on the facts when they don't even know the facts and will call me names and tell me to quit crying, bottom line in this matter is that the neighbor is in the wrong and he will pay for this. I will not stop until something is done and the laws are changed. Yes in Texas this would have been a criminal offense and this should also be a criminal offense here as well. This report was to see if anybody knew of any other law other than trespassing was broken and to get the general public view on this matter. And wow what a response. The reason we have such a problem with this here in Louisiana is the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Well if it takes me to fight for a change in the law I will. I think if all us sportsman get together on this matter and push for stiffer fines it would help with the problem of people hunting were they are not supposed to. So please if you can't read the report for what it is, please dont respond at all. I will not defend my case to you.

AS for the WLF they have stepped up and are working hard for us the public, we are working together on this matter. And as for trespassing they are not the ones to police the trespassing law, I am working with the DA office on this matter. The WLF has charged the man with not tagging his deer and other charges are pending. The DA will charge the man with trespassing and it may go criminal, and other charges may follow as well. Thanks for all the response's and I will not respond to any more stupid and name calling responses, I am sorry if I have insulted anyone but know the facts before you let your fingers do the talking. Thanks to the Dept of WLF and sheriffs office for all the help on this matter. HAVE A GOOD DAY!!!

The guy must have buddies on this sight. Knowingly shooting a deer on someone elses land without permission is unethical. If the guy was warned and still did this there is a problem. If he did not think what he did was wrong he would have waited around to make his point known to the officials or would have taken the deer with him. Sorry what the guy did was not right. Let someone fire a round in your direction while you are hunting after they have be warned not to and tell us how you feel. Sounds like there are more unsafe hunters out there than I thought. Fight this battle. Would anyone teach there child to shoot their high powered rifle in a direction that is unsafe?? This is why hunter safety courses are required to obtain a license.

To hunt 1500 acres and have this big of a problem with one hunter and go though all the crap of the courts is what I see as pathetic. I sure wouldn't teach my child this type of hunting but it sounds like this is how the present generation was raised. Back when this crap began, where I lived in the 1970's, it was the Dr and Lawyers sons that were hunting daddy's lease; because they were the only ones renting marsh land, that attempted to rule the marsh pulling guns on fishermen for being in the canal that bordered daddy's lease. No one was one their lease. Now they claim the waterways, the wildlife and want everyone to hunt like them or your not a sportsman. That's a bunch of crap. These same folks are quick to check a persons crab traps, nets or trot-lines and find nothing wrong with that. They dam up the slews and small canals fish use to enter and exit the marsh and were the best fishing is due to the running waters. They do this so THEY can hunt ducks and that is illegal but nothing is done. In the basin one club dug a ditch to drain a Lake the Courts proved was navigable, all without a permit, and nothing is done while the public is shut out. But one man crosses a fence to retrieve his deer and you want to divert resources from the sheriff's office. LDWF, DA and who knows who else. Anyone can put up a fence and does not prove a property line. I have had property surveyed and the guy next door bought the next house and their survey was different so even surveys can be wrong. I was always taught to hunt 100 ft off a property line to be on the safe side and if someone hunts 1500 acres and cannot have a buffer zone with the neighbors for them to retrieve their deer is plane old chicken poop. Slab, you posted on this site to get answers and if you don't like them then their wrong, put in who's eyes. You say he cut your trees and if you have that on tape then you have a case but in my eyes the rest is not worth the time spent. All you are going to do pushing this issue to create an enemy someplace you should not want one. Two guys being butts only cause problems!! But I guess some guys have to prove their right.

Slab. . .If you really have 1500 acres, why are you yourself hunting on the property line that seperates you and your 'wrong acting' neighbors. However, if he is in fact cutting your timber that is a criminal and civil issue, but you seem to be taking the joy out of hunting when you need not be.

So what if the OP was hunting near his property line. Perhaps you would do the same if it were your property. The man can do whatever he wants on his property as long as he abides by the law.

Plain and simple his neighbor is in the wrong according to the facts presented.

If anything I would think the man would have our support yet there are a few on here bashing the man for no apparent reason other than they likely are plain confused over what he reported originally.

Jeesh, good luck slab, I hope these idiots get what's coming to them!

...Jefroka

This thread is unbelievable. A man has people poaching on his land and everyone is attacking him. Pretty sad state of affairs when someone that has 1500 acres to hunt is expected to cede some of it to the neighbors for free.

Is this site overrun with poachers or is it that the hunters with ethics has just remained silent, I assume the latter... I hope.

Mike hit it out the park on that one. Good call brother!! Problem is that you accomplish more talking to a pile of dried up dog poo than trying to teach morals or justice to a person posting that garbage.

Slab...good luck I'm on your side.

im all the way with u bro, that is some bull that dudes on ya land, what i would do is wait for him to be outside and go confront him. And all the other people thas trying to say your wrong, its bull he's on ya land, what parish u in, down here in lafourche he would be hit with them tickets, the police and the game wardens are money hungry down here!!!!!

we hunt in lafouche and the have a guy that flys over our marsh in a helicopter lookin for deer....flew over my stand at 5pm last year,messed up my night hunt.I asked my grandpa about it he says 'u ought to see them when they see a big buck,theyll push them out onto their land.just glad my dad doesnt hunt with us or it would have probably looked like black hawk down.

What a loser!

Slab do not respond to Idiots. If Cajun cannot read your hunting 300 yd. from the property he should not comment. Dont pay attention to people like Ray ,if he quit hunting because of problems like this & could not get it taken of by the law then he should not comment on your post.But the point of all this is you are within your rights my Brother keep fightin & GO TIGERS.Also glad you agree Mike.

I know this post is based on one persons side of the story. And assuming what he said is an accurate account of the events. I can't understand how some of you justify what the other guy did, shooting deer (two bucks?)on this guys property. Regardless of where his butt is when the trigger is pulled, you don't shoot onto other peoples property, period. If the guy was confronted and ran back across the fence as stated, that should tell you something right there. I hope you get some satifaction from this, but I don't put much stock in them doing the right thing.

jffb57. . .I read the orginal post very carefully. My problem is that if indeed the facts are correct as reported, the complaint should be made in the courts where both stories can be told. We do not have a perfect justice system, but we got the best in the world.

My problem with many of these posts is that anti-hunting groups, PETA, and others, search these sites on a constant basis. They then cut and paste the post(s) and create there own propangda to be used in lobbying efforts. I have personally witnessed this being done not only in Baton Rouge but also in Washington.

When we start talking about taking the laws in our own hands, or LWF and other agencies not doing there job, we are giving PETA and all others more ammunition to be used against us.

Never did I say slab was wrong and his neighbor was right. So jffb57, would YOU please read carefully my post before you accuse me of saying something I did not.

This maybe the next Obama plan. Everyone gets to shoot deer on their neighbors side of the fence. LOL

as i stated earlier slab o later,Im on your side! It really pisses me off that some people on here either cant read and comprehend a story or they are just too stupid too have any common sense!! As far as watching what we post b/c of peta and other groups....who cares!!I commented,as did others,about law enforcement not doing thier jobs and until this post was up they weren't! Unless people stand up to them and make them do thier jobs they will just abuse it!

Slab o later,I just have one question,you said LDWLF said you could have the deer at first but then left with them,what made them change thier mind? Personally I think they are friends with the violaters!

papa-p...'ya got a good point !!!...Bush Sr. did say we gonn'a have a 'New Order' ???...I have a collection of 'em...think I have that one framed and matted ???...cheers

This is a good post! Hope more information is forthcoming. I do have to ask Mike Guerin about his statement that, and I copy and pasted here, 'One thing is true and that it isn't illegal to shoot a deer on your neighbors property'. How is this not illegal? Is this a La. law? I hunt in Ms. and I have never heard of this being permissible, nor would I attempt to do this. If it is, then I know a guy that has property next to a 'high fence' and he gas seen some very fine bucks.! Good luck!

Thats How It Works the System Really Messed Up@least ya got 2 Deer

Not a lawyer but I have seen it posted quite a few times when these threads come up. One of them was from the Mississippi state run message board a few years ago before it was basically shutdown. So I am assuming it is both Mississippi and Louisiana.

BirdDog. . .You should care, we all should care, because the anti-hunting and animal rights groups are ten times more organized then us, then times more wealthy then us, and spend nearly 35 times more than hunting groups do on lobbyist (state and federal, all public record).

Have you ever witness a member from an animal rights group arguing on a public forum with another member of that group or threatening vigilanty justice against that member.

You need to care what these groups think of us hunters. But if you still not convinced or concerned, then google REX STUART and read a little about his massive online petitions and his anti-hunting coalitions. This guy's presence in Washington is more frequent then DU, DW and NRA combined.

I feel for the OP, but I have now been called an idiot because I simply asked for all the facts before taking a side.

well I dont care,I dont have all the #'s but there are way too many hunters and it brings in way to much money for them to do anything to us!
YOu are right however that they are more organized! If we stuck together the way other groups or races do this country wouldnt be in the shape its in!!

BirdDog. . . You admit you don't have the numbers but you call me and others 'idiots'. I do agree that hunters/fishermen/boaters, etc. do pump alot of money into the economy of state and federal coffers, but we simply are not united as a solidary group for a common purpose. In fact, every group on 'our' side is actually doing more to destroy other groups on 'our' side than promoted our common causes.

I see it everyday, and it is very frustrating. The OP was frustrated and has every right to be frustated; however, if we had a strong voice in Washington and Baton Rouge, we could have clear laws which would prevent problems like OP has come across.

I never called you an idiot.I said 'it pisses me of when people on here are too stupid to read and comprehend a mans post or just to stupid to use common sense.

BirdDog...Sorry. I stand corrected. You called me stupid, Jffb57 called me an idiot.

cajun315,I didnt call you stupid either.....once again,I said ' it really pisses me off that people on here are too stupid to read and comprehend a mans post or just to stupid to use common sense! If one of the two pertains to you then I guess I did!

This attitude of everyone is a poacher proves we are headed in the same direction of England when the common people rebelled against the nobles(landowners)for the same thing that will eventually happen here. When the only ones that can hunt are the people that will pay the price demanded by the landowners. I know Apache bought up lots of land around Vermilion Bay and doubled and tripled the lease prices to get rid all hunters. The price was paid and leased out to the highest bidder and everyone who used to fish the marsh were also kicked out even tough the hunters don't fish it. People that hunted and trapped Pecan Island all their life and lived there for many years can no longer hunt south of Hwy 82 and before long it will be I-10. Amoco created their lease on White Lake and I remember stories of how their customers would go there and kill hundreds of ducks while we had to follow the limit. All these folks that no longer hunt has kids who will never hunt and so on and eventually they will turn against the hunters and join groups such as PETA. On the other hand, if this last recession had turned into a depression there would be civil war over the food supply when the landowners and the few that can lease land attempt to stop folks from feeding their families just as occurred between the Nobles and common men of England. I have seen it begin with hunting and rapidly moving into fishing with more waterways being claimed as private. Anywhere else in the country this could not happen to our waterways. Ray