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A MUST READ FOR AREA 6 HUNTERS!!!!

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It says the meeting will be going on tomorrow, but I found the article to be very interesting so thought I'd share.

http://www.bayoubucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6239
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   CuHuntin
I am all for it. I dont think its gonna make a difference we dont do anything but kill does until the rut starts anyways. I hunt in the middle of this area and if they dont go back to the old doe days you can hang up deer hunting period. shooting does til the end of season does nothing but kill your heard especially after the middle of december .
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   ruger35
Thanks for the info...personally I wouldn't mind if they brought back the 6 point or better rule. Heck, even make it 8. They repealed the law after 3 years last time which is when us hutners would have just been seeing the results.

This would really help those of us in the Spillway who don't run dogs but the next lease does and they shoot anything that has more than two legs.
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What will they do about the # of dog days?That's the problem with population.I know,here we go again.
Lets see some numbers of deer killed by bow hunters,then still hunters,then dog hunters.There is no comparison that they take out more deer.It's way to many days for dogs.Deer go nocturnal and that ends the season.
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   JB
I hunt in Grosse Tete and would love to see this happen. October is usually so freakin' hot and the skeeters are unbearable.

Last season, I had spotted fawns on camera the week before Christmas.

This year, our deer never really started chasing. We have seen deer chasing during turkey season before.

Keeping it closed until November would allow more squirrel hunting to take place.

DO IT!!!!!!!
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The real problems is to many MO FO's going hunting in a small area. 3 deer TO (TWENTY HUNTERS) ratio in area 6
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   cajun1953
Cuhuntin,
Good comment on the doe days you are right about that and I have to agree with you no that.
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   JB
I've wondered that as well. Tons of pressure have made the deer nocturnal. Is it possible that pressure has also caused them to breed late?

How long will it take a species to evolve and change it's habits?

As for doe days, I agree with that also. I keep telling the other guys in my lease that we kill too many does and they say I am wrong. I have been in this lease for 4 years and each year we kill twice as many does as we do bucks. How many years can a herd sustain that kind of unbalanced harvest?
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   CuHuntin
I hunt two leases in area 6 One is north and the other south . In the south we use dogs its swamp and hard hunting the north is still only where guys feed repeatedly . We have a 3 on one side rule in the north and anything goes south. I can tell you this in the south we allow one doe per member we have plenty of does we only killed 16 deer this year with 25 members of the deer killed 6 were doe the rest buck. In the north 2 does per member you are lucky to buy a deer there the last few years .Over the last years we havent killed over 15 deer in the north lease in the last 4 years . I have pictures of plenty of bucks but by the time the rut starts there arent many does left to breed our heard has been shrinking ever since they did away with the six point or better experiment and added the doe a day till the end of season . I will say this i think the dog days are all but almost over for good before to long the anti hunter will take the still hunt away to . If hunters dont stick together our heritage will be gone.
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   Dirtnap
Some of you guys need to wake up and get off of this point restriction bull. Any club that has this is lost in the 60's. Why in the world would you want all your younger bucks with good genetics shot. It's funny when I hear guys say we have an 8 point or better rule, or a 3 on one side rule. Thats great kill all of your 1 1/2 year old eight points but let all the older scrub bucks walk because they don't have enough points.
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I hunt in area 6. 100% against it. Leave it like it is.
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   JDMANN
What difference does it make when a doe is killed? Bred or not, she will never have another fawn...she's DEAD! It doesn't matter when she is harvested. If you think you can convince me otherwise, I'm listening and will be open-minded. Please have some documented evidence and not what happened at so and so's camp or "I heard from my podnah". As to dog hunting, there are two months before dog season, and one month after to deer hunt. Where is the inequity (90 days vs 44 days)?
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   JB
It's not when a doe is killed as much as it is being able to kill one any day of the season. When there were specific doe days, there were less does killed.

I like the doe days everyday, and I don't like it. I won't shoot more than 2 does a year. Most of the time, I will only kill 1. If I kill one with my bow and don't kill a buck by the last muzzle loader season, I'll shoot another doe but if I kill a buck, I will only shoot 1 doe. That being said, I know some people that would kill 75 does if the limit was 75.

If I could just get the guys in my lease to see that killing twice as many does as bucks will have a serious impact on the heard in the long run.
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   JDMANN
Yes. Bag limits are very liberal. The LDWF wants a certain number of does killed each season. Some will kill none or one, and some will kill quite a few more. I think it averages out. As to specific leases, it's up to the members or landowners to set harvest expectations. The landowner can do as he pleases(within the law) and clubs will be majority rule (hopefully).
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I can't say how i feel about changing the season cause it may benefit the herd, being that most are shot during the rut maybe there is an advantage in it being the way it is. I wouldn't complain either way...

What i do wonder is why this state has a 6 deer limit... Most states have much less than this and shoot bigger deer.... I can't see what anyone would do with 6 deer but i am not about judging that its just that seems like a high limit.... I am sure it has something to do with license sales but it sure seems that the limits could be lowered... I know some are gonna beat me up for this but i am open to ideas...
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I hunt with dogs and raised dogs. I also still hunt. We have 8500 acres leased and have a certain amount of does that we take each year and we stop.
Now about the deer going nocturnal and you not seeing. I dog hunt in the morning and still hunt the afternoon and very few hunts i don't see deer. So you might want to try another lease and stop blaming the dog hunters.
Now on the tags I don't think its worth a s--t. Because like I said our club sets a limit and we kill about the same amount each year. But others do not control their clubs and thats going to be the problem, and still hunters are just as quilty when they kill three does in a year.
Just my thoughts.

Happy Hunting
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Bucks are smaller here bc there are too many does. You don't see a hard rut bc there are too many does. They're nocturnal bc there is too much pressure. Just because you don't see a lot of deer doesn't mean they aren't here they just don't like being hunted and go to bed when the sun comes up. We need a year with unlimited doe harvest on private land and a good increase on public. One buck kill per year would keep people from shooting babies. Meat hunters can have their doe meat. A lot of people would be outraged by these rules and hunt less = less pressure. The next year big bucks will be running all over.
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Well I really don't care for it. First of all I hunt deer but deer is not the only hunts in La. Now a days you must belong to a club to hunt about anything and with the proposed change, this will probably restrict other hunting in area 6. It is a big deal with fewer and fewer folks getting interested in hunting and the state selling fewer liscenses. More club restrictions on small game hunting (and also duck hunting) means fewer kids in the woods and less interest in overall hunting. Also seems to me with a rut in February might protect some animals and overall help the herd. Just my 2 cents.
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   JB
Rabbit hunters will hate this if it passes. They have put up with having to wait until rifle season ends to turn beagles loose. They still have a month and a half, if it changes, they will have 2 weeks.
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   gauger
Very good discussion going on.
Now, my thoughts............
I like and appreciate the tag system we have going now. It's about time. A majority of hunters have restricted days they can hunt due to other commitments, so the tags let them put some meat in the freezer and keep them interested. It also keeps the large crowds from showing up on specified doe days. I'm lucky. My wife lets me hunt as much as I can. This year, I was blessed to miss only 2 weeknds of gun season. I hunt in the heart of the Basin. We did well this year, killing 1 eleven point, 3 nice eights, a few spikes, and about 6 does. not bad for a small group. Most of our deer were shot in front of the dogs. We hunt as main area of about 450 acres. I was there enough to know that we left plenty of deer in the swamp including a few very nice deer that anyone would be proud to hang on the wall. as a side note, the 11 point was about toothless. My semiedumacated guesstimate puts him at about 4-5 years old.
The past 3 years that I've hunted this area, I've noticed a LATE rut. We didn't start seeing scrapes or rubs till late December.
It would be interesting to give the proposal by Mr. Moreland a try. The man is wiser than most about Louisiana deer.
I would like to see the rabbit season extended to the end of March. I hope that would not interfere with the swampchicken hunters as I not up on the season dates.
Change is scary for a bunch of us. lol Let's pay attantion to what's going on.
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RE:What's Wrong With Doe Harvest?
What difference does it make when a doe is killed? Bred or not, she will never have another fawn...she's DEAD! It doesn't matter when she is harvested. If you think you can convince me otherwise, I'm listening and will be open-minded.

I had the same thought for a while but this is where I stand now...If you kill a doe in early October that was bread in March and the gestion period of a whitetail is around 7 months, you are basically taking out two or possibly three deer, as most of you know a healthy two year old doe will have twin fawns and if the doe were bread in Febuary and gave birth late September or Early October the chance of the yearling survivng at one month old without its mother are slim to none....just my thoughts....
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I do believe that we need to harvest does. But three per year per hunter is just to many. In the 80's the same lease I spoke of earlier thought they need to manage the lease better and brought in the professors (biologist) we were told that we had to kill this many does well hell they were the experts so we did. THREE YEARS LATER WE COULD NOT BUY A DEER ON THAT LEASE.....

My opinion 1 doe 2 bucks one of with 6 point or better.

Thanks
Happy Hunting
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if your browse is ate to the height of 7 ft from the ground OR you hunt and see herds of 40 does ata a time and no bucks--then you need to shott a few does-I ihave never hunted anywhere like that in La. Every doe you kill will never have a doe fawn or twin fawns those fawns will never have a buck or doe fawn---im not a math guy but when that is extrapolated out for 10 yrs it amounts to a ton of deer no one will ever see or shoot--all from the shooting of one doe deer-give it some thought before you go crazy with comments it is math pure and simple also read the university of Georgia study on coyote depreditation on fawns-it will open your eyes and make a coyote hunter out of you.
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   Dirtnap
There is a big difference on what you are trying to accomplish. Some of you are getting confused between trying to manage for quality bucks and managing for just total number of deer. Most areas have a buck doe ratio that is out of balance so obviously if you didn't kill more does than bucks the problem would only get worse. If you want to sit on stand and see 30 does every hunt then yes you need to stop killing does in your area. If you want bucks to have to search for does in a balanced herd then you need to keep shooting does. Also if clubs stay lost in the 60's with antler restrictions you will never have the quality of bucks that you are capable of having. The only way to manage for quality bucks is to kill the inferior older bucks and let the young ones with good genetics walk. With antler restrictions you will never accomplish your goals.
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   JB
I agree, antler restrictions are not the end all cure all BUT, it is better than nothing. We used to be on a point restriction and have since gone to a width/length requirement and it has made all the difference in the world. We still kill some real good 2 1/2 year old deer that would be incredible 3 1/2-4 1/2 year old's but we are also killing more and more 4 1/2 year old's.

We are going up on our requirements for next season and I can't wait to see the results in a few years.
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I am talking about Public Land.Upper St. Mary lower St.Martin.Twenty years ago there were lots of deer.Would see deer every time you went in the woods.At that time the only time you would see dogs was at the end of the season.Just a few hunters were running dogs.Now everyone and his brother has a dog.One has 40 dogs he keeps.One group will take out 40 to 60 deer a year.That's crazy.
Club rules work on leases,but there needs to be tighter rules on Public land so everyone can enjoy it.Your idea of 1 doe 2 bucks one of with 6 point or better sounds good.I'm just saying that in the last twenty years up there the population has gone down alot.
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   ruger35
Dogs were never as prevalent as they are now. The lease next to ours runs them, and doesn't even put a half hearted attempt to pick them up. I have had 3 dogs living by my stand and eating the food that I put out for at least a month now. I have tried to catch them to bring them in but can't. I have even notified one of their members to let them know and his response was "yea, we can't catch that one with the blue collar." I want everyone to enjoy hunting as much as the next person, but both types of hunters need to be responsible. Dogs or no dogs, the whole state needs to manage its deer better so everyone can kill mature bucks.
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   JDMANN
Yes, simple Math is easy. Each doe killed will lose all offspring she and her progeny could have produced to infinity. That is not a problem. Each trophy buck killed will never pass his dominant genes again. If we are overpopulated, more deer need to be harvested, period. If we manage for bigger antlers, more deer need to be harvested. If there are too few deer, cut back on the limit. The carrying capacity {K} of a given land area is determined by available food source. You either provide much more food or harvest more animals.
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   Dago1986
All very good points, just thought I'd put my two cents in.

To the season being starting and ending later: I think it's a great idea. The only time we seem to kill bucks is during the rut and we miss the best part of the rut (2nd peak) every year.

To dogs: I don't think dogs help or hurt the deer population. We ran dogs for years before quitting a couple of years ago and have yet to see more or less deer killed.

To the 6 deer limit: I think 6 is too many. As crazy as it might sound, and I know people will completely disagree. Change the limit to 3 deer of your choice for a few years then go to maybe 4. I know many will be against this, but what better to help the population than to have hunters be more selective and kill less deer?

To having doe days everyday: I am all for being able to kill does everyday. I don't think this hurts the population. What hurts it is killing does with little ones. Even a yearling needs milk from its mother to grow to its full potential.

.....just my opinion..
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I think not killing enough does hurts the population a whole lot more than killing a few too many
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I would agree with a 3 tag system for a few years and see what comes out of it. As for as for the state land issue I think that some of the dumba--es that hunt state land and have no clue how to hunt or what to hunt is more of an issue than the dogs that are run on state land. That is the reason the deer disappear during the season. And I also believe that our poor St. of Louisiana should lease out state land (not management land but state land).

Thanks
Happy Hunting
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i think 3 as well, no more than 4
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